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Can a person still be an Orthodox Jew and believe that the Torah contains narratives that are not scientifically correct?
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Can a person still be an Orthodox Jew and believe that the Torah contains narratives that are not scientifically correct?
Bereishit vs. scienceVoting for a person that will not uphold Torah valuesGood books for non-Jews who are interested in understanding Judaism, especially branches of Orthodox judaismHow are pre-creation >4000 BCE human civilization and pre-flood >2300 BCE civilizations that continued reconciled with Judaism?Is there any precedent to read the first 11 chapters of Genesis as metaphorical?Does Judaism have a double standard?Can an Orthodox Jew go to a reform burial?Why does Orthodox Judaism not believe in the New Testament?Can someone explain the idea that God “created the world with the Torah”?How do we know that non-commandments in the Torah still apply today?What is the Halachic protocol for assessing an alleged Apikores?
I am taking the position that perhaps the Torah does contain narratives that are not scientifically correct, such as the creation and early human history narratives found in the first 11 chapters of Bereshit. Something to have in mind before you give your answer is that Rambam’s 13 principles seem to say that we should believe that God gave everything in the Torah to Moses (I suppose that would even include some of the narratives that are not scientifically factual), and that nothing in the Torah changed or will ever change. So now with that in mind: Would believing that some of the narratives in the Torah are not scientifically factual no longer make me Orthodox and brand me as a heretic, or would I still remain Orthodox?
hashkafah-philosophy creation orthodox
edited 4 hours ago
Clifford Durousseau
1,232623
asked 4 hours ago
user19166user19166
162
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show 5 more comments
I am taking the position that perhaps the Torah does contain narratives that are not scientifically correct, such as the creation and early human history narratives found in the first 11 chapters of Bereshit. Something to have in mind before you give your answer is that Rambam’s 13 principles seem to say that we should believe that God gave everything in the Torah to Moses (I suppose that would even include some of the narratives that are not scientifically factual), and that nothing in the Torah changed or will ever change. So now with that in mind: Would believing that some of the narratives in the Torah are not scientifically factual no longer make me Orthodox and brand me as a heretic, or would I still remain Orthodox?
hashkafah-philosophy creation orthodox
edited 4 hours ago
Clifford Durousseau
1,232623
asked 4 hours ago
user19166user19166
162
New contributor
user19166 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
2
Can you define "Orthodox"? There's no official orthodox governing body
– Double AA♦
4 hours ago
Those communities and members that have a stringent observance of Halacha. I really don't know any other way to define it.
– user19166
4 hours ago
1
@Menachem fwiw the Rabbi alluded to is Rabbi Moshe Ben Maimon and you rely on his rulings all the time in one way or another.
– Double AA♦
3 hours ago
1
There are plenty of very observant Jews who daven at Orthodox shuls, keep kosher, keep Shabbat and believe, for example, the 6 days of creation lasted much longer than the sort of days we are accustombed to,that perhaps there are parts of the world that were not destroyed by the Mabul (Flood), and have many other non-literal interpretations of events in Tanakh, particularly in Bereshit.
– Josh K
3 hours ago
1
Helpful question with many answers judaism.stackexchange.com/questions/30/bereishit-vs-science
– alicht
3 hours ago
|
show 5 more comments
I am taking the position that perhaps the Torah does contain narratives that are not scientifically correct, such as the creation and early human history narratives found in the first 11 chapters of Bereshit. Something to have in mind before you give your answer is that Rambam’s 13 principles seem to say that we should believe that God gave everything in the Torah to Moses (I suppose that would even include some of the narratives that are not scientifically factual), and that nothing in the Torah changed or will ever change. So now with that in mind: Would believing that some of the narratives in the Torah are not scientifically factual no longer make me Orthodox and brand me as a heretic, or would I still remain Orthodox?
hashkafah-philosophy creation orthodox
edited 4 hours ago
Clifford Durousseau
1,232623
asked 4 hours ago
user19166user19166
162
New contributor
user19166 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
I am taking the position that perhaps the Torah does contain narratives that are not scientifically correct, such as the creation and early human history narratives found in the first 11 chapters of Bereshit. Something to have in mind before you give your answer is that Rambam’s 13 principles seem to say that we should believe that God gave everything in the Torah to Moses (I suppose that would even include some of the narratives that are not scientifically factual), and that nothing in the Torah changed or will ever change. So now with that in mind: Would believing that some of the narratives in the Torah are not scientifically factual no longer make me Orthodox and brand me as a heretic, or would I still remain Orthodox?
hashkafah-philosophy creation orthodox
hashkafah-philosophy creation orthodox
edited 4 hours ago
Clifford Durousseau
1,232623
asked 4 hours ago
user19166user19166
162
New contributor
user19166 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
edited 4 hours ago
Clifford Durousseau
1,232623
asked 4 hours ago
user19166user19166
162
New contributor
user19166 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
edited 4 hours ago
Clifford Durousseau
1,232623
edited 4 hours ago
Clifford Durousseau
1,232623
edited 4 hours ago
Clifford Durousseau
1,232623
1,232623
asked 4 hours ago
user19166user19166
162
New contributor
user19166 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
asked 4 hours ago
user19166user19166
162
asked 4 hours ago
user19166user19166
162
162
New contributor
user19166 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
New contributor
user19166 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
2
Can you define "Orthodox"? There's no official orthodox governing body
– Double AA♦
4 hours ago
Those communities and members that have a stringent observance of Halacha. I really don't know any other way to define it.
– user19166
4 hours ago
1
@Menachem fwiw the Rabbi alluded to is Rabbi Moshe Ben Maimon and you rely on his rulings all the time in one way or another.
– Double AA♦
3 hours ago
1
There are plenty of very observant Jews who daven at Orthodox shuls, keep kosher, keep Shabbat and believe, for example, the 6 days of creation lasted much longer than the sort of days we are accustombed to,that perhaps there are parts of the world that were not destroyed by the Mabul (Flood), and have many other non-literal interpretations of events in Tanakh, particularly in Bereshit.
– Josh K
3 hours ago
1
Helpful question with many answers judaism.stackexchange.com/questions/30/bereishit-vs-science
– alicht
3 hours ago
|
show 5 more comments
2
Can you define "Orthodox"? There's no official orthodox governing body
– Double AA♦
4 hours ago
Those communities and members that have a stringent observance of Halacha. I really don't know any other way to define it.
– user19166
4 hours ago
1
@Menachem fwiw the Rabbi alluded to is Rabbi Moshe Ben Maimon and you rely on his rulings all the time in one way or another.
– Double AA♦
3 hours ago
1
There are plenty of very observant Jews who daven at Orthodox shuls, keep kosher, keep Shabbat and believe, for example, the 6 days of creation lasted much longer than the sort of days we are accustombed to,that perhaps there are parts of the world that were not destroyed by the Mabul (Flood), and have many other non-literal interpretations of events in Tanakh, particularly in Bereshit.
– Josh K
3 hours ago
1
Helpful question with many answers judaism.stackexchange.com/questions/30/bereishit-vs-science
– alicht
3 hours ago
2
2
Can you define "Orthodox"? There's no official orthodox governing body
– Double AA♦
4 hours ago
Can you define "Orthodox"? There's no official orthodox governing body
– Double AA♦
4 hours ago
Those communities and members that have a stringent observance of Halacha. I really don't know any other way to define it.
– user19166
4 hours ago
Those communities and members that have a stringent observance of Halacha. I really don't know any other way to define it.
– user19166
4 hours ago
1
1
@Menachem fwiw the Rabbi alluded to is Rabbi Moshe Ben Maimon and you rely on his rulings all the time in one way or another.
– Double AA♦
3 hours ago
@Menachem fwiw the Rabbi alluded to is Rabbi Moshe Ben Maimon and you rely on his rulings all the time in one way or another.
– Double AA♦
3 hours ago
1
1
There are plenty of very observant Jews who daven at Orthodox shuls, keep kosher, keep Shabbat and believe, for example, the 6 days of creation lasted much longer than the sort of days we are accustombed to,that perhaps there are parts of the world that were not destroyed by the Mabul (Flood), and have many other non-literal interpretations of events in Tanakh, particularly in Bereshit.
– Josh K
3 hours ago
There are plenty of very observant Jews who daven at Orthodox shuls, keep kosher, keep Shabbat and believe, for example, the 6 days of creation lasted much longer than the sort of days we are accustombed to,that perhaps there are parts of the world that were not destroyed by the Mabul (Flood), and have many other non-literal interpretations of events in Tanakh, particularly in Bereshit.
– Josh K
3 hours ago
1
1
Helpful question with many answers judaism.stackexchange.com/questions/30/bereishit-vs-science
– alicht
3 hours ago
Helpful question with many answers judaism.stackexchange.com/questions/30/bereishit-vs-science
– alicht
3 hours ago
|
show 5 more comments
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
The Torah, the Talmud and Chazal do not use the artificial label "Orthodox" or recognize subcategories of Judaism, it is just one religion. And you remain as Jewish as the rest of us even if you question and doubt. Yes, events described in the Torah are ofttimes inconsistent with laws of nature as we know it, or current scientific knowledge, and could only have occurred miraculously. We believe in miracles, and that things happen beyond the rules of nature, Shelo B'derech Hateva. Don't label or brand yourself if you do not yet see the miracles in every day life.
answered 4 hours ago
dandan
1146
add a comment |
The Rambam believed that the Torah is not intended to be history or science, but ethical teachings:
Those passages in the Bible, which, in their literal sense, contain statements that can be refuted by proof, can and must be interpreted otherwise. [Rambam, Guide to the Perplexed, 2:25]
answered 1 hour ago
Maurice MizrahiMaurice Mizrahi
2,617315
add a comment |
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
The Torah, the Talmud and Chazal do not use the artificial label "Orthodox" or recognize subcategories of Judaism, it is just one religion. And you remain as Jewish as the rest of us even if you question and doubt. Yes, events described in the Torah are ofttimes inconsistent with laws of nature as we know it, or current scientific knowledge, and could only have occurred miraculously. We believe in miracles, and that things happen beyond the rules of nature, Shelo B'derech Hateva. Don't label or brand yourself if you do not yet see the miracles in every day life.
answered 4 hours ago
dandan
1146
add a comment |
The Torah, the Talmud and Chazal do not use the artificial label "Orthodox" or recognize subcategories of Judaism, it is just one religion. And you remain as Jewish as the rest of us even if you question and doubt. Yes, events described in the Torah are ofttimes inconsistent with laws of nature as we know it, or current scientific knowledge, and could only have occurred miraculously. We believe in miracles, and that things happen beyond the rules of nature, Shelo B'derech Hateva. Don't label or brand yourself if you do not yet see the miracles in every day life.
answered 4 hours ago
dandan
1146
add a comment |
The Torah, the Talmud and Chazal do not use the artificial label "Orthodox" or recognize subcategories of Judaism, it is just one religion. And you remain as Jewish as the rest of us even if you question and doubt. Yes, events described in the Torah are ofttimes inconsistent with laws of nature as we know it, or current scientific knowledge, and could only have occurred miraculously. We believe in miracles, and that things happen beyond the rules of nature, Shelo B'derech Hateva. Don't label or brand yourself if you do not yet see the miracles in every day life.
answered 4 hours ago
dandan
1146
The Torah, the Talmud and Chazal do not use the artificial label "Orthodox" or recognize subcategories of Judaism, it is just one religion. And you remain as Jewish as the rest of us even if you question and doubt. Yes, events described in the Torah are ofttimes inconsistent with laws of nature as we know it, or current scientific knowledge, and could only have occurred miraculously. We believe in miracles, and that things happen beyond the rules of nature, Shelo B'derech Hateva. Don't label or brand yourself if you do not yet see the miracles in every day life.
answered 4 hours ago
dandan
1146
edited 3 hours ago
answered 4 hours ago
dandan
1146
answered 4 hours ago
dandan
1146
answered 4 hours ago
dandan
1146
1146
add a comment |
add a comment |
The Rambam believed that the Torah is not intended to be history or science, but ethical teachings:
Those passages in the Bible, which, in their literal sense, contain statements that can be refuted by proof, can and must be interpreted otherwise. [Rambam, Guide to the Perplexed, 2:25]
answered 1 hour ago
Maurice MizrahiMaurice Mizrahi
2,617315
add a comment |
The Rambam believed that the Torah is not intended to be history or science, but ethical teachings:
Those passages in the Bible, which, in their literal sense, contain statements that can be refuted by proof, can and must be interpreted otherwise. [Rambam, Guide to the Perplexed, 2:25]
answered 1 hour ago
Maurice MizrahiMaurice Mizrahi
2,617315
add a comment |
The Rambam believed that the Torah is not intended to be history or science, but ethical teachings:
Those passages in the Bible, which, in their literal sense, contain statements that can be refuted by proof, can and must be interpreted otherwise. [Rambam, Guide to the Perplexed, 2:25]
answered 1 hour ago
Maurice MizrahiMaurice Mizrahi
2,617315
The Rambam believed that the Torah is not intended to be history or science, but ethical teachings:
Those passages in the Bible, which, in their literal sense, contain statements that can be refuted by proof, can and must be interpreted otherwise. [Rambam, Guide to the Perplexed, 2:25]
answered 1 hour ago
Maurice MizrahiMaurice Mizrahi
2,617315
answered 1 hour ago
Maurice MizrahiMaurice Mizrahi
2,617315
answered 1 hour ago
Maurice MizrahiMaurice Mizrahi
2,617315
answered 1 hour ago
Maurice MizrahiMaurice Mizrahi
2,617315
2,617315
add a comment |
add a comment |
2
Can you define "Orthodox"? There's no official orthodox governing body
– Double AA♦
4 hours ago
Those communities and members that have a stringent observance of Halacha. I really don't know any other way to define it.
– user19166
4 hours ago
1
@Menachem fwiw the Rabbi alluded to is Rabbi Moshe Ben Maimon and you rely on his rulings all the time in one way or another.
– Double AA♦
3 hours ago
1
There are plenty of very observant Jews who daven at Orthodox shuls, keep kosher, keep Shabbat and believe, for example, the 6 days of creation lasted much longer than the sort of days we are accustombed to,that perhaps there are parts of the world that were not destroyed by the Mabul (Flood), and have many other non-literal interpretations of events in Tanakh, particularly in Bereshit.
– Josh K
3 hours ago
1
Helpful question with many answers judaism.stackexchange.com/questions/30/bereishit-vs-science
– alicht
3 hours ago