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Question in discrete mathematics about group permutations


Composition of permutation to generate all permutationsBasic question on permutationsPermutations and disjoint cyclesHow can I solve an equation with permutations using their disjoint cycles?How to Write Permutation as the Product of Transpositions?Writing permutation as a product of transpositionsWriting Permutations as Product of Disjoint CyclesCycle decomposition of permutationsWhy write permutations as disjoint cycles and transpositions?Regular permutations













3












$begingroup$


So I have this question and i got pretty much stuck.



  1. Let $pi$ be the permutation
    $$pi= (1 2 3 4 5 6 7)circ(1 3 5 7)circ(2 4 6)$$ of the set $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$. Write $pi$ as a product of disjoint cycles and determine if is an
    odd or even permutation.

I learnt how to do permutations(i guess) but from the whole permutation rows. Can someone help me uderstand what am i missing?



The solution is supposed to be $$pi=(1 4 7 2 5)circ(3 6)$$



Thanks a lot in advance!










share|cite|improve this question









New contributor



user10635779 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.






$endgroup$











  • $begingroup$
    It might help to rephrase this as "can you give a partition of $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$ such that $pi$ preserves that partition?"
    $endgroup$
    – Couchy311
    8 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    Welcome to MSE. You should learn some MathJax to format your questions.
    $endgroup$
    – saulspatz
    8 hours ago















3












$begingroup$


So I have this question and i got pretty much stuck.



  1. Let $pi$ be the permutation
    $$pi= (1 2 3 4 5 6 7)circ(1 3 5 7)circ(2 4 6)$$ of the set $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$. Write $pi$ as a product of disjoint cycles and determine if is an
    odd or even permutation.

I learnt how to do permutations(i guess) but from the whole permutation rows. Can someone help me uderstand what am i missing?



The solution is supposed to be $$pi=(1 4 7 2 5)circ(3 6)$$



Thanks a lot in advance!










share|cite|improve this question









New contributor



user10635779 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.






$endgroup$











  • $begingroup$
    It might help to rephrase this as "can you give a partition of $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$ such that $pi$ preserves that partition?"
    $endgroup$
    – Couchy311
    8 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    Welcome to MSE. You should learn some MathJax to format your questions.
    $endgroup$
    – saulspatz
    8 hours ago













3












3








3





$begingroup$


So I have this question and i got pretty much stuck.



  1. Let $pi$ be the permutation
    $$pi= (1 2 3 4 5 6 7)circ(1 3 5 7)circ(2 4 6)$$ of the set $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$. Write $pi$ as a product of disjoint cycles and determine if is an
    odd or even permutation.

I learnt how to do permutations(i guess) but from the whole permutation rows. Can someone help me uderstand what am i missing?



The solution is supposed to be $$pi=(1 4 7 2 5)circ(3 6)$$



Thanks a lot in advance!










share|cite|improve this question









New contributor



user10635779 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.






$endgroup$




So I have this question and i got pretty much stuck.



  1. Let $pi$ be the permutation
    $$pi= (1 2 3 4 5 6 7)circ(1 3 5 7)circ(2 4 6)$$ of the set $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$. Write $pi$ as a product of disjoint cycles and determine if is an
    odd or even permutation.

I learnt how to do permutations(i guess) but from the whole permutation rows. Can someone help me uderstand what am i missing?



The solution is supposed to be $$pi=(1 4 7 2 5)circ(3 6)$$



Thanks a lot in advance!







group-theory discrete-mathematics permutations permutation-cycles






share|cite|improve this question









New contributor



user10635779 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.










share|cite|improve this question









New contributor



user10635779 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.








share|cite|improve this question




share|cite|improve this question








edited 8 hours ago









saulspatz

19.4k41636




19.4k41636






New contributor



user10635779 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.








asked 8 hours ago









user10635779user10635779

161




161




New contributor



user10635779 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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New contributor




user10635779 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.













  • $begingroup$
    It might help to rephrase this as "can you give a partition of $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$ such that $pi$ preserves that partition?"
    $endgroup$
    – Couchy311
    8 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    Welcome to MSE. You should learn some MathJax to format your questions.
    $endgroup$
    – saulspatz
    8 hours ago
















  • $begingroup$
    It might help to rephrase this as "can you give a partition of $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$ such that $pi$ preserves that partition?"
    $endgroup$
    – Couchy311
    8 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    Welcome to MSE. You should learn some MathJax to format your questions.
    $endgroup$
    – saulspatz
    8 hours ago















$begingroup$
It might help to rephrase this as "can you give a partition of $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$ such that $pi$ preserves that partition?"
$endgroup$
– Couchy311
8 hours ago




$begingroup$
It might help to rephrase this as "can you give a partition of $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$ such that $pi$ preserves that partition?"
$endgroup$
– Couchy311
8 hours ago












$begingroup$
Welcome to MSE. You should learn some MathJax to format your questions.
$endgroup$
– saulspatz
8 hours ago




$begingroup$
Welcome to MSE. You should learn some MathJax to format your questions.
$endgroup$
– saulspatz
8 hours ago










4 Answers
4






active

oldest

votes


















6












$begingroup$

$1 xrightarrowtext(246) 1 xrightarrowtext(1357) 3 xrightarrowtext(1234567)4 $



$4 xrightarrowtext(246) 6 xrightarrowtext(1357) 6 xrightarrowtext(1234567)7 $



$7 xrightarrowtext(246) 7 xrightarrowtext(1357) 1 xrightarrowtext(1234567)2 $



$2 xrightarrowtext(246) 4 xrightarrowtext(1357) 4 xrightarrowtext(1234567)5 $



$5 xrightarrowtext(246) 5 xrightarrowtext(1357) 7 xrightarrowtext(1234567)1 $



So we have $(14725)$



$3 xrightarrowtext(246) 3 xrightarrowtext(1357) 5 xrightarrowtext(1234567)6 $



$6 xrightarrowtext(246) 2 xrightarrowtext(1357) 2 xrightarrowtext(1234567)3 $



So we have $(36)$



Combining we have $(14725)circ(36)$



$(14725)$ is even and $(36)$ is odd. The composition is odd.






share|cite|improve this answer









$endgroup$




















    2












    $begingroup$

    Note that:




    • $pi(1)=4$;


    • $pi(4)=7$;


    • $pi(7)=2$;


    • $pi(2)=5$;


    • $pi(5)=1$.

    Now, you already have the cycle $(1 4 7 2 5)$. Among the elements of $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$, the ones that appear in it are $1$, $2$, $4$,$5$, and $7$. Now, start all over again, with an element that doesn't appear in it, such as $3$. You will get another cycle: $(3 6)$. And now there are no more elements left in $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$. So, $pi=(1 4 7 2 5)circ(3 6)$ indeed.



    So, since $pi$ is the composition of an even permutation with an odd one, it is an odd permutation.






    share|cite|improve this answer









    $endgroup$




















      2












      $begingroup$

      You can get that $pi=(14725)(36)$ just by checking where each element goes. That is, you have $1to4to7to2to5to1$ and $3to6to3$.



      Once you have that, it follows that $pi$ is odd, since odd length cycles are even. For instance, $pi=(15)(12)(17)(14)(36)$.



      (It is a theorem that the parity of the number of transpositions a permutation can be written as the product of is an invariant. This invariant is called the sign of the permutation, $bfsgn(pi)$.)






      share|cite|improve this answer











      $endgroup$




















        1












        $begingroup$

        The permutation $(2 4 6)$ is the function that maps $2$ to $4$, $4$ to $6$, $6$ to $2$, and leaves the other elements fixed. The permutations are composed from left to right. To see the effect of $pi$ on $2$, for example, we see that the first permutation maps $2$ to $3$, the second permutation maps $3$ to $5$, and the last permutation maps $5$ to $5$ so that $pi(2)=5.$ You need to do this for every element.



        It is not a universal convention that the permutations compose from left to right. Indeed, I expected that they would compose from right to left, as functions generally do, but that gave the wrong answer.






        share|cite|improve this answer









        $endgroup$













          Your Answer








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          4 Answers
          4






          active

          oldest

          votes








          4 Answers
          4






          active

          oldest

          votes









          active

          oldest

          votes






          active

          oldest

          votes









          6












          $begingroup$

          $1 xrightarrowtext(246) 1 xrightarrowtext(1357) 3 xrightarrowtext(1234567)4 $



          $4 xrightarrowtext(246) 6 xrightarrowtext(1357) 6 xrightarrowtext(1234567)7 $



          $7 xrightarrowtext(246) 7 xrightarrowtext(1357) 1 xrightarrowtext(1234567)2 $



          $2 xrightarrowtext(246) 4 xrightarrowtext(1357) 4 xrightarrowtext(1234567)5 $



          $5 xrightarrowtext(246) 5 xrightarrowtext(1357) 7 xrightarrowtext(1234567)1 $



          So we have $(14725)$



          $3 xrightarrowtext(246) 3 xrightarrowtext(1357) 5 xrightarrowtext(1234567)6 $



          $6 xrightarrowtext(246) 2 xrightarrowtext(1357) 2 xrightarrowtext(1234567)3 $



          So we have $(36)$



          Combining we have $(14725)circ(36)$



          $(14725)$ is even and $(36)$ is odd. The composition is odd.






          share|cite|improve this answer









          $endgroup$

















            6












            $begingroup$

            $1 xrightarrowtext(246) 1 xrightarrowtext(1357) 3 xrightarrowtext(1234567)4 $



            $4 xrightarrowtext(246) 6 xrightarrowtext(1357) 6 xrightarrowtext(1234567)7 $



            $7 xrightarrowtext(246) 7 xrightarrowtext(1357) 1 xrightarrowtext(1234567)2 $



            $2 xrightarrowtext(246) 4 xrightarrowtext(1357) 4 xrightarrowtext(1234567)5 $



            $5 xrightarrowtext(246) 5 xrightarrowtext(1357) 7 xrightarrowtext(1234567)1 $



            So we have $(14725)$



            $3 xrightarrowtext(246) 3 xrightarrowtext(1357) 5 xrightarrowtext(1234567)6 $



            $6 xrightarrowtext(246) 2 xrightarrowtext(1357) 2 xrightarrowtext(1234567)3 $



            So we have $(36)$



            Combining we have $(14725)circ(36)$



            $(14725)$ is even and $(36)$ is odd. The composition is odd.






            share|cite|improve this answer









            $endgroup$















              6












              6








              6





              $begingroup$

              $1 xrightarrowtext(246) 1 xrightarrowtext(1357) 3 xrightarrowtext(1234567)4 $



              $4 xrightarrowtext(246) 6 xrightarrowtext(1357) 6 xrightarrowtext(1234567)7 $



              $7 xrightarrowtext(246) 7 xrightarrowtext(1357) 1 xrightarrowtext(1234567)2 $



              $2 xrightarrowtext(246) 4 xrightarrowtext(1357) 4 xrightarrowtext(1234567)5 $



              $5 xrightarrowtext(246) 5 xrightarrowtext(1357) 7 xrightarrowtext(1234567)1 $



              So we have $(14725)$



              $3 xrightarrowtext(246) 3 xrightarrowtext(1357) 5 xrightarrowtext(1234567)6 $



              $6 xrightarrowtext(246) 2 xrightarrowtext(1357) 2 xrightarrowtext(1234567)3 $



              So we have $(36)$



              Combining we have $(14725)circ(36)$



              $(14725)$ is even and $(36)$ is odd. The composition is odd.






              share|cite|improve this answer









              $endgroup$



              $1 xrightarrowtext(246) 1 xrightarrowtext(1357) 3 xrightarrowtext(1234567)4 $



              $4 xrightarrowtext(246) 6 xrightarrowtext(1357) 6 xrightarrowtext(1234567)7 $



              $7 xrightarrowtext(246) 7 xrightarrowtext(1357) 1 xrightarrowtext(1234567)2 $



              $2 xrightarrowtext(246) 4 xrightarrowtext(1357) 4 xrightarrowtext(1234567)5 $



              $5 xrightarrowtext(246) 5 xrightarrowtext(1357) 7 xrightarrowtext(1234567)1 $



              So we have $(14725)$



              $3 xrightarrowtext(246) 3 xrightarrowtext(1357) 5 xrightarrowtext(1234567)6 $



              $6 xrightarrowtext(246) 2 xrightarrowtext(1357) 2 xrightarrowtext(1234567)3 $



              So we have $(36)$



              Combining we have $(14725)circ(36)$



              $(14725)$ is even and $(36)$ is odd. The composition is odd.







              share|cite|improve this answer












              share|cite|improve this answer



              share|cite|improve this answer










              answered 8 hours ago









              CY AriesCY Aries

              19.5k11845




              19.5k11845





















                  2












                  $begingroup$

                  Note that:




                  • $pi(1)=4$;


                  • $pi(4)=7$;


                  • $pi(7)=2$;


                  • $pi(2)=5$;


                  • $pi(5)=1$.

                  Now, you already have the cycle $(1 4 7 2 5)$. Among the elements of $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$, the ones that appear in it are $1$, $2$, $4$,$5$, and $7$. Now, start all over again, with an element that doesn't appear in it, such as $3$. You will get another cycle: $(3 6)$. And now there are no more elements left in $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$. So, $pi=(1 4 7 2 5)circ(3 6)$ indeed.



                  So, since $pi$ is the composition of an even permutation with an odd one, it is an odd permutation.






                  share|cite|improve this answer









                  $endgroup$

















                    2












                    $begingroup$

                    Note that:




                    • $pi(1)=4$;


                    • $pi(4)=7$;


                    • $pi(7)=2$;


                    • $pi(2)=5$;


                    • $pi(5)=1$.

                    Now, you already have the cycle $(1 4 7 2 5)$. Among the elements of $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$, the ones that appear in it are $1$, $2$, $4$,$5$, and $7$. Now, start all over again, with an element that doesn't appear in it, such as $3$. You will get another cycle: $(3 6)$. And now there are no more elements left in $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$. So, $pi=(1 4 7 2 5)circ(3 6)$ indeed.



                    So, since $pi$ is the composition of an even permutation with an odd one, it is an odd permutation.






                    share|cite|improve this answer









                    $endgroup$















                      2












                      2








                      2





                      $begingroup$

                      Note that:




                      • $pi(1)=4$;


                      • $pi(4)=7$;


                      • $pi(7)=2$;


                      • $pi(2)=5$;


                      • $pi(5)=1$.

                      Now, you already have the cycle $(1 4 7 2 5)$. Among the elements of $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$, the ones that appear in it are $1$, $2$, $4$,$5$, and $7$. Now, start all over again, with an element that doesn't appear in it, such as $3$. You will get another cycle: $(3 6)$. And now there are no more elements left in $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$. So, $pi=(1 4 7 2 5)circ(3 6)$ indeed.



                      So, since $pi$ is the composition of an even permutation with an odd one, it is an odd permutation.






                      share|cite|improve this answer









                      $endgroup$



                      Note that:




                      • $pi(1)=4$;


                      • $pi(4)=7$;


                      • $pi(7)=2$;


                      • $pi(2)=5$;


                      • $pi(5)=1$.

                      Now, you already have the cycle $(1 4 7 2 5)$. Among the elements of $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$, the ones that appear in it are $1$, $2$, $4$,$5$, and $7$. Now, start all over again, with an element that doesn't appear in it, such as $3$. You will get another cycle: $(3 6)$. And now there are no more elements left in $1,2,3,4,5,6,7$. So, $pi=(1 4 7 2 5)circ(3 6)$ indeed.



                      So, since $pi$ is the composition of an even permutation with an odd one, it is an odd permutation.







                      share|cite|improve this answer












                      share|cite|improve this answer



                      share|cite|improve this answer










                      answered 8 hours ago









                      José Carlos SantosJosé Carlos Santos

                      186k24145259




                      186k24145259





















                          2












                          $begingroup$

                          You can get that $pi=(14725)(36)$ just by checking where each element goes. That is, you have $1to4to7to2to5to1$ and $3to6to3$.



                          Once you have that, it follows that $pi$ is odd, since odd length cycles are even. For instance, $pi=(15)(12)(17)(14)(36)$.



                          (It is a theorem that the parity of the number of transpositions a permutation can be written as the product of is an invariant. This invariant is called the sign of the permutation, $bfsgn(pi)$.)






                          share|cite|improve this answer











                          $endgroup$

















                            2












                            $begingroup$

                            You can get that $pi=(14725)(36)$ just by checking where each element goes. That is, you have $1to4to7to2to5to1$ and $3to6to3$.



                            Once you have that, it follows that $pi$ is odd, since odd length cycles are even. For instance, $pi=(15)(12)(17)(14)(36)$.



                            (It is a theorem that the parity of the number of transpositions a permutation can be written as the product of is an invariant. This invariant is called the sign of the permutation, $bfsgn(pi)$.)






                            share|cite|improve this answer











                            $endgroup$















                              2












                              2








                              2





                              $begingroup$

                              You can get that $pi=(14725)(36)$ just by checking where each element goes. That is, you have $1to4to7to2to5to1$ and $3to6to3$.



                              Once you have that, it follows that $pi$ is odd, since odd length cycles are even. For instance, $pi=(15)(12)(17)(14)(36)$.



                              (It is a theorem that the parity of the number of transpositions a permutation can be written as the product of is an invariant. This invariant is called the sign of the permutation, $bfsgn(pi)$.)






                              share|cite|improve this answer











                              $endgroup$



                              You can get that $pi=(14725)(36)$ just by checking where each element goes. That is, you have $1to4to7to2to5to1$ and $3to6to3$.



                              Once you have that, it follows that $pi$ is odd, since odd length cycles are even. For instance, $pi=(15)(12)(17)(14)(36)$.



                              (It is a theorem that the parity of the number of transpositions a permutation can be written as the product of is an invariant. This invariant is called the sign of the permutation, $bfsgn(pi)$.)







                              share|cite|improve this answer














                              share|cite|improve this answer



                              share|cite|improve this answer








                              edited 8 hours ago

























                              answered 8 hours ago









                              Chris CusterChris Custer

                              15.6k3827




                              15.6k3827





















                                  1












                                  $begingroup$

                                  The permutation $(2 4 6)$ is the function that maps $2$ to $4$, $4$ to $6$, $6$ to $2$, and leaves the other elements fixed. The permutations are composed from left to right. To see the effect of $pi$ on $2$, for example, we see that the first permutation maps $2$ to $3$, the second permutation maps $3$ to $5$, and the last permutation maps $5$ to $5$ so that $pi(2)=5.$ You need to do this for every element.



                                  It is not a universal convention that the permutations compose from left to right. Indeed, I expected that they would compose from right to left, as functions generally do, but that gave the wrong answer.






                                  share|cite|improve this answer









                                  $endgroup$

















                                    1












                                    $begingroup$

                                    The permutation $(2 4 6)$ is the function that maps $2$ to $4$, $4$ to $6$, $6$ to $2$, and leaves the other elements fixed. The permutations are composed from left to right. To see the effect of $pi$ on $2$, for example, we see that the first permutation maps $2$ to $3$, the second permutation maps $3$ to $5$, and the last permutation maps $5$ to $5$ so that $pi(2)=5.$ You need to do this for every element.



                                    It is not a universal convention that the permutations compose from left to right. Indeed, I expected that they would compose from right to left, as functions generally do, but that gave the wrong answer.






                                    share|cite|improve this answer









                                    $endgroup$















                                      1












                                      1








                                      1





                                      $begingroup$

                                      The permutation $(2 4 6)$ is the function that maps $2$ to $4$, $4$ to $6$, $6$ to $2$, and leaves the other elements fixed. The permutations are composed from left to right. To see the effect of $pi$ on $2$, for example, we see that the first permutation maps $2$ to $3$, the second permutation maps $3$ to $5$, and the last permutation maps $5$ to $5$ so that $pi(2)=5.$ You need to do this for every element.



                                      It is not a universal convention that the permutations compose from left to right. Indeed, I expected that they would compose from right to left, as functions generally do, but that gave the wrong answer.






                                      share|cite|improve this answer









                                      $endgroup$



                                      The permutation $(2 4 6)$ is the function that maps $2$ to $4$, $4$ to $6$, $6$ to $2$, and leaves the other elements fixed. The permutations are composed from left to right. To see the effect of $pi$ on $2$, for example, we see that the first permutation maps $2$ to $3$, the second permutation maps $3$ to $5$, and the last permutation maps $5$ to $5$ so that $pi(2)=5.$ You need to do this for every element.



                                      It is not a universal convention that the permutations compose from left to right. Indeed, I expected that they would compose from right to left, as functions generally do, but that gave the wrong answer.







                                      share|cite|improve this answer












                                      share|cite|improve this answer



                                      share|cite|improve this answer










                                      answered 8 hours ago









                                      saulspatzsaulspatz

                                      19.4k41636




                                      19.4k41636




















                                          user10635779 is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.









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                                          user10635779 is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.












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                                          user10635779 is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.














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